Messages from Usenet group comp.lang.idl-pvwave, compiled by Paulo Penteado
Folks, Partly so I could feel the pain in the Linux user, and partly because I'm a masochist at heart, I decided to download IDL on a Linux machine. I spent the better part of an evening downloading the latest Fedora Core 4 Linux OS and put it on an old Dell laptop. I still don't have a mouse working, but the touch pad is OK, and everything else seems to be in order, so I downloaded the latest IDL from the RSI web page and followed the installation instructions to the letter. No problems there. But when I go to run IDL I get a message about "error loading shared library: libXp.so.6. No such file or directory". It is looking for it in the /usr/local/rsi/idl_6.2/bin/bin.linux.86 directory, and, sure enough, it is not there. Any ideas what I am doing wrong here? Any idea how I might get a mouse working? Thanks, David -- David Fanning, Ph.D. Fanning Software Consulting, Inc. Coyote's Guide to IDL Programming: http://www.dfanning.com/
David: I am no expert by a long shot, but have you tried Mandriva? I use 10.1 and haven't had problems with it in the last year, on desktops or laptops..... Siddharth
Sid writes: > I am no expert by a long shot, but have you tried Mandriva? I use 10.1 > and haven't had problems with it in the last year, on desktops or > laptops..... Uh, no. I only have 24 hours in a day. I can't afford to download more than 5 or 6 flavors of LINUX. :-) By the way, I am *really* getting into this. If I wanted to buy a new laptop with LINUX installed and ready to go, what would you LIXUX users recommend? I need a pretty powerful machine for a new proposed project. Cheers, David -- David Fanning, Ph.D. Fanning Software Consulting, Inc. Coyote's Guide to IDL Programming: http://www.dfanning.com/
In article <MPG.1e42cf41300b6219989b40@news.frii.com>, David Fanning <davidf@dfanning.com> wrote: > By the way, I am *really* getting into this. If I wanted > to buy a new laptop with LINUX installed and ready to go, > what would you LIXUX users recommend? I need a pretty > powerful machine for a new proposed project. > > Cheers, > > David Apple Powerbook ;-) I know, I know, IDL won't be native for a while. Has anyone gotten an Intel Mac who can test IDL under emulation? Ken
Kenneth Bowman wrote: > In article <MPG.1e42cf41300b6219989b40@news.frii.com>, > David Fanning <davidf@dfanning.com> wrote: > >> By the way, I am *really* getting into this. If I wanted >> to buy a new laptop with LINUX installed and ready to go, >> what would you LIXUX users recommend? I need a pretty >> powerful machine for a new proposed project. >> >> Cheers, >> >> David > > Apple Powerbook ;-) > > I know, I know, IDL won't be native for a while. Has anyone gotten an Intel Mac > who can test IDL under emulation? > > Ken It seems that the Intel Macs are not all that Apple would like you to believe: http://www.macworld.com/2006/01/features/imaclabtest1/index. php -- Nigel Wade, System Administrator, Space Plasma Physics Group, University of Leicester, Leicester, LE1 7RH, UK E-mail : nmw@ion.le.ac.uk Phone : +44 (0)116 2523548, Fax : +44 (0)116 2523555
In article <drcq3b$5rn$1@south.jnrs.ja.net>, Nigel Wade <nmw@ion.le.ac.uk> wrote: > http://www.macworld.com/2006/01/features/imaclabtest1/index. php There are arguments about this going on in several places. http://apple.slashdot.org/apple/06/01/26/2038249.shtml > madgunde writes "Looks like MacWorld magazine was a little premature in > reporting that the new Apple iMac Core Duo doesn't live up to Apple's speed > claims. The folks over at MacSpeedZone have done some performance testing of > their own that debunks MacWorld's results and shows that the new iMac Core > Duo DOES live up to the hype. The benchmarks Apple showed are SPECmarks, which may or may not be what you care about. For scientific computing they are probably a reasonable starting point. I'll withhold judgement until I get to run *my* codes. ;-) Ken Bowman
On Thu, 26 Jan 2006, Kenneth Bowman wrote: > I know, I know, IDL won't be native for a while. Has anyone > gotten an Intel Mac who can test IDL under emulation? My code runs fine on the developer machine. I haven't checked into the speed of it with benchmarks, but it feels about the same speed. -k.
On Thu, 26 Jan 2006 12:22:01 -0700, David Fanning wrote: > Sid writes: > >> I am no expert by a long shot, but have you tried Mandriva? I use 10.1 >> and haven't had problems with it in the last year, on desktops or >> laptops..... > > Uh, no. I only have 24 hours in a day. I can't afford to > download more than 5 or 6 flavors of LINUX. :-) > > By the way, I am *really* getting into this. If I wanted > to buy a new laptop with LINUX installed and ready to go, > what would you LIXUX users recommend? I need a pretty > powerful machine for a new proposed project. I really don't know how much luck you'll have finding a laptop with just LINUX on it. I'm sure that there are some out there, but I also think that it is safe to say that your choices in the hardware would be limited. I ended up getting a Toshiba Satellite with Win XP on it. The first thing I did when I got it was to boot it with Knoppix, live off the CD. Knoppix, and other recent distros, have a tool that will let you shrink an NTFS partition in place without reformatting the drive. This tool let me split the internal hard disk in half. I think I also made a small (2GB) FAT partition so I have some disk space shared between LINUX and Windows. LINUX doesn't *write* to NTFS very well these days. I then installed Debian on the second half and went ahead and put the GRUB boot loader on. That lets me select Win or LINUX at power on time. I almost always just close the lid to hiberate Windows, so I don't see the GRUB menu very much. It works well. I think it is probably pretty important to get the features you need/want in a laptop purchase and then worry about adding LINUX later. There are websites out there that describe how various LINUX distros work on many laptops. They might be worth checking as you narrow down your choices. Good luck, Karl
Karl Schultz writes: > I really don't know how much luck you'll have finding a laptop with just > LINUX on it. I'm sure that there are some out there, but I also think > that it is safe to say that your choices in the hardware would be limited. I have been taken aback to receive a number of private e-mails cautioning against expecting too much from LINUX on a laptop. This has surprised me. I guess because I got caught up in the excitement of the LINUX evangelists. I just *assumed* LINUX would work well everywhere. I am beginning to appreciate why the new Mac machines are such a big deal. It brings Windows reliability to the LINUX world. :-) > I ended up getting a Toshiba Satellite with Win XP on it. The first thing > I did when I got it was to boot it with Knoppix, live off the CD. > Knoppix, and other recent distros, have a tool that will let you shrink an > NTFS partition in place without reformatting the drive. This tool let me > split the internal hard disk in half. I think I also made a small (2GB) > FAT partition so I have some disk space shared between LINUX and > Windows. LINUX doesn't *write* to NTFS very well these days. > > I then installed Debian on the second half and went ahead and put the GRUB > boot loader on. That lets me select Win or LINUX at power on time. I > almost always just close the lid to hiberate Windows, so I don't see the > GRUB menu very much. It works well. Well, this sounds like a project I can sink my teeth into, and I have just the machine to try it out on. I guess I better go get BitTorrent first, though, or it will be another slow day in Colorado. > I think it is probably pretty important to get the features you need/want > in a laptop purchase and then worry about adding LINUX later. There are > websites out there that describe how various LINUX distros work on many > laptops. They might be worth checking as you narrow down your choices. The thing I am MOST surprised about, is that LINUX users will pay that extra premium to have Windows installed on their laptops. I guess they just think of it as an insurance premium. :-) Cheers, David -- David Fanning, Ph.D. Fanning Software Consulting, Inc. Coyote's Guide to IDL Programming: http://www.dfanning.com/
> I have been taken aback to receive a number of > private e-mails cautioning against expecting too > much from LINUX on a laptop. This has surprised > me. I guess because I got caught up in the excitement > of the LINUX evangelists. I just *assumed* LINUX > would work well everywhere. I am beginning to > appreciate why the new Mac machines are such a big > deal. It brings Windows reliability to the LINUX > world. :-) I have been taken aback by how many private emails you got cautioning you against Linux on a laptop. Of course, I don't know how many emails you got, but I'm assuming it was a pretty good number given your statement. Linux DOES work well on most systems. I have Linux installed on my laptop. My co-workers have many Linux installed on their laptops as well. None of us have any problems. I hear people say that Linux doesn't work well on laptops. I hear that it's unreliable on laptops. But it every time someone says something like this 9 times out of 10 they have a very unique non-typical hardware configuration or have a misconception about what Linux can do. I had Linux put on my laptop when I first got it and haven't had any issues with it. Around here we have a lovely mixture of Dell and Micron and IBM, and you might even see a Sony Vaio here or there and I haven't seen anyone who has problems. The problems I do see are people who think they can go buy the latest bleeding edge hardware and expect everything to work. Because it's still mainly a Windows world, the Windows drivers get written first. That's especially true for graphics cards. I don't know if it's still the case today, but I know that people would have problems with nVidia cards because Linux was not allowed to include the driver that the nVidia people wrote. There was some legal issue on the nVidia side, not the Linux side, that caused this. Anyway, you had to download the driver from nVidia and install it manually, but some people just didn't know to do that. And then they complained about Linux not including the driver even though the Linux folks wanted to include it. >> I think it is probably pretty important to get the features you need/want >> in a laptop purchase and then worry about adding LINUX later. There are >> websites out there that describe how various LINUX distros work on many >> laptops. They might be worth checking as you narrow down your choices. This reads like it's really hard to get the features you want and have Linux. It's not hard at all. Of course, my feature list only includes a ton of RAM, big beefy processor, a nice graphics card, and a burner. I guess some people just want more. ;-) > The thing I am MOST surprised about, is that LINUX users > will pay that extra premium to have Windows installed on > their laptops. I guess they just think of it as an insurance > premium. :-) For a long time, some companies wouldn't let you buy a laptop if it didn't have Windows on it. There were deals done between M$ and the OEMs so that Windows would be on every laptop and there wasn't an option to get a laptop with no OS. I don't mean to sound like a Linux zealot or anything. Sure, I use it and it satisfies my particular needs better than any other OS whether that's Windows, OS X, Solaris or something else. If Windows suits your needs, use it. If Solaris suits your needs, use it. If you have a need for using Linux, that's one thing. If you don't have a particular need for it, you'll probably wind up disappointed by something. -Mike
Michael Wallace wrote: > > Linux DOES work well on most systems. I have Linux installed on my > laptop. My co-workers have many Linux installed on their laptops as > well. None of us have any problems. > I think Linux does run well on most laptops, but you will most likely have problems gettings all of the little features like sound volume, screen brightness, external VGA output etc. to work, which are all very vendor-specific. The touchpad will probably work, but its scroll feature might not... Things which are important to some people, but less important to others. If you're lucky, somebody wrote a driver, but it might not be included in your Linux distro. You'll have to get your hands dirty yourself. Benjamin
On 2006-01-27, Nigel Wade <nmw@ion.le.ac.uk> wrote: > It seems that the Intel Macs are not all that Apple would like you to believe: > > http://www.macworld.com/2006/01/features/imaclabtest1/index. php Not that I have a dog in this fight, since I use Linux on opterons, but a different viewpoint can be found at: http://www.macspeedzone.com/html/hardware/machine/performanc e_in_the_raw/06/1_23.shtml
>> Linux DOES work well on most systems. I have Linux installed on my >> laptop. My co-workers have many Linux installed on their laptops as >> well. None of us have any problems. >> > > I think Linux does run well on most laptops, but you will most likely > have problems gettings all of the little features like sound volume, > screen brightness, external VGA output etc. to work, which are all very > vendor-specific. The touchpad will probably work, but its scroll feature > might not... These days the only thing that is really vendor specific is the graphics card. Most sound and other features are covered. The last laptop install I did was when Fedora Core 4 came out. With Fedora, *everything* worked out of the box. The only hiccup was that I had to add some vendor specific settings to get the full use of my graphics card. Out of the box, I could use an external display with my laptop. The vendor specific settings were only to allow the external display to use higher resolutions. I did not have to tinker with anything else. > Things which are important to some people, but less > important to others. If you're lucky, somebody wrote a driver, but it > might not be included in your Linux distro. You'll have to get your > hands dirty yourself. A few years ago, I would have agreed with this. I can't speak for all distributions since I don't use them, but Fedora and SuSE have been very good recently with respect to supporting things out of the box. I actually don't remember the last time I had to search a sound driver and configure something by hand except for the case of the graphics card I've already mentioned. Everything else Just Works(TM). -Mike
Michael Wallace <mwallace.nospam@swri.edu.invalid> writes: > A few years ago, I would have agreed with this. I can't speak for all > distributions since I don't use them, but Fedora and SuSE have been very good > recently with respect to supporting things out of the box. I actually don't > remember the last time I had to search a sound driver and configure something > by hand except for the case of the graphics card I've already mentioned. > Everything else Just Works(TM). I'll agree for the most part, but having yesterday (and the 3 or 5 days before that) just put suse10 on my inspiron 8500, I'm aware of a few things that can be tricky, mainly wireless. It certainly doesn't work out of the box. And finding the "right" drivers was nothing short of Homeric. I'm not a sysadmin, but have been using *nix for many many years, and I nearly threw my computer out the window. Matt -- Matthew Savoie - Scientific Programmer National Snow and Ice Data Center (303) 735-0785 http://nsidc.org
In article <MPG.1e440d21573f5daa989b42@news.frii.com>, David Fanning <davidf@dfanning.com> wrote: > > .... It brings Windows reliability to the LINUX a ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > world. :-) Good one, that! Glad to see the Linux has not yet destroyed your sense of humour :-)) -- Surendar Jeyadev jeyadev1@wrc.xerox.com The 1 in the email address is fake
Surendar Jeyadev writes: > Good one, that! Glad to see the Linux has not yet destroyed > your sense of humour :-)) Thanks goodness. I was afraid no one was reading my posts anymore. :-) Cheers, David -- David Fanning, Ph.D. Fanning Software Consulting, Inc. Coyote's Guide to IDL Programming: http://www.dfanning.com/
In article <MPG.1e4445d1d35a2373989b43@news.frii.com>, David Fanning <davidf@dfanning.com> wrote: > Surendar Jeyadev writes: > >> Good one, that! Glad to see the Linux has not yet destroyed >> your sense of humour :-)) > > Thanks goodness. I was afraid no one was reading my > posts anymore. :-) Wouldn't miss even one! But, can't add much to what has been said before. Did get the WalMart Linux laptop and is just fine for the purpose for which it was bought. But, once you get to vendor specific stuff .... I agree with the rest that it can be painful. -- Surendar Jeyadev jeyadev1@wrc.xerox.com The 1 in the email address is fake
On Thu, 26 Jan 2006 12:22:01 -0700, David Fanning wrote: > Sid writes: > By the way, I am *really* getting into this. If I wanted > to buy a new laptop with LINUX installed and ready to go, > what would you LIXUX users recommend? I need a pretty > powerful machine for a new proposed project. Installing Linux is usually trivial these days. I'd shop for the laptop you want (I hear good things about the new Core Due systems), with the features you want, and then head to: http://www.linux-laptop.net/ to see if there any compatibility issues (sound cards are common). Mostly things do indeed just work. The reason IDL complains is that it needs an old, old version of the C library and other libs, which most distros offer as a "compatibility" library install. You can blame RSI for this, building against what is essentially a 4 year old library set (not that it doesn't work). If the Macbook Pro's are as nice as they seem to be, getting one of those, and dual-booting linux/OSX would seem a rather nice solution. Redhat recently officially announced support for Mac Intel. It would be interesting to see how much Linux/IDL 6.2 cleans up OSX/IDL 6.2 Rosetta (assuming it runs), and then repeat the comparison when they finally compile IDL for OSX/Intel later this year (hopefully). I have friends in the laptop market now, and no clear RSI statement on their commitment to support this new architecture is unsettling to them. "We'll look into and get back to you" is less than confidence-inspiring. JD
On Fri, 27 Jan 2006 19:47:53 +0000, Greg Hennessy wrote: > On 2006-01-27, Nigel Wade <nmw@ion.le.ac.uk> wrote: >> It seems that the Intel Macs are not all that Apple would like you to believe: >> >> http://www.macworld.com/2006/01/features/imaclabtest1/index. php > > Not that I have a dog in this fight, since I use Linux on opterons, > but a different viewpoint can be found at: > > http://www.macspeedzone.com/html/hardware/machine/performanc e_in_the_raw/06/1_23.shtml My strong impression is that, for large arrays (say 200,000 elements and more), the MacBook should be around 4-5 times faster at basic processing in IDL (not reading/writing to disk, drawing to screen, etc, but FFT's, arithmetic, etc.) than the Powerbook G4's they replace. In fact I'd be willing to make a wager to this effect. Each core of the Core Duo is about as fast as a G5. If you are hammering away at both cores, you'll really embarrass your old PB. I expect *very* similar performance for Linux laptops with the Core Duo and the MacBook: same compiler, very similar libraries, same processor, same memory sub-system, etc. Macs may lag a bit due to the extra overhead of function calls, but it should be close. It will be nice not to suffer the "PPC" penalty under IDL (though we lament the unrealized potential which was Altivec). Macworld's test was something of a joke. Though useful, because it reflects real world typical-use performance, we could easily design benchmarks in IDL which actually stress the dual CPU cores to their maximum, and we would find much different results. Here's a hint. This is not a CPU benchmark: IDL> openw,un,/get_lun & writeu,un,lindgen(10000000L) & free_lun,un JD
JD Smith wrote: > On Thu, 26 Jan 2006 12:22:01 -0700, David Fanning wrote: > > >> Sid writes: > > >> By the way, I am *really* getting into this. If I wanted >> to buy a new laptop with LINUX installed and ready to go, >> what would you LIXUX users recommend? I need a pretty >> powerful machine for a new proposed project. > > > Installing Linux is usually trivial these days. I'd shop for the > laptop you want (I hear good things about the new Core Due systems), > with the features you want, and then head to: > > http://www.linux-laptop.net/ > > to see if there any compatibility issues (sound cards are common). Mostly > things do indeed just work. > > The reason IDL complains is that it needs an old, old version of the C > library and other libs, which most distros offer as a "compatibility" > library install. You can blame RSI for this, building against what is > essentially a 4 year old library set (not that it doesn't work). That's just laughable. > If the Macbook Pro's are as nice as they seem to be, getting one of > those, and dual-booting linux/OSX would seem a rather nice solution. > Redhat recently officially announced support for Mac Intel. It would > be interesting to see how much Linux/IDL 6.2 cleans up OSX/IDL 6.2 > Rosetta (assuming it runs), and then repeat the comparison when they > finally compile IDL for OSX/Intel later this year (hopefully). > > I have friends in the laptop market now, and no clear RSI statement on > their commitment to support this new architecture is unsettling to > them. "We'll look into and get back to you" is less than > confidence-inspiring. From my uneducated viewpoint, RSI always seems to be playing catch-up in this regard. On the plus side (and off on a tangent - crikey, it's late), I bit the bullet and spent an hour plotting gobs and gobs of data using iPlot and, somewhere, somehow, I managed to figure out how to use it effectively despite the clunkiness of the "Visualization Browser". Even with the slowness of the application I guess I'm, well, impressed. (off I go into the corner to eat my hat.... ) paulv -- Paul van Delst CIMSS @ NOAA/NCEP/EMC