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| Re: IDL 7.0 .... any new functions? [message #56997 is a reply to message #56986] |
Thu, 29 November 2007 09:11   |
R.G.Stockwell
Messages: 163
Registered: October 2004
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"David Fanning" <news@dfanning.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.21b8718d13c8aa2c98a107@news.frii.com...
> Well, no. But I do have a (growing!) list of tools, filters,
> etc. that I *would* use if someone where kind enough to
> build them for me.
...
>> This DE thing was way over due, especially on Linux/Mac, where
>> the old DE was completely unworkable.
>
> No argument from me here.
...
> I'm just saying, that unless ITTVIS is talking about
> "growing" a cash crop (I find their web page confusing
> on this issue), I'm not sure my next year of IDL
> programming will look too much different from my last
> year.
..
> Cleaning up noise pollution is a worthy goal. And I applaud
> them for that. But certainly one of the jobs of a software
> company is to fix and improve software. I'd like to see some
> of that, too.
my two cents, I feel exactly the way David does.
I have not used itools at all. I have not employed
object graphics - since for my mode of analyzing data
in a reproducible way prohibits random GUI exploration
(other than as a first look) and creating publishable figures
and animations for presentations - there is apparently no
need for object graphics (perhaps my plots are too simple).
I also do not do GUI programming in IDL. I have done
a great deal of GUI programming in Labview (and if one is used
to t-bone steaks, going back to gruel is unpleasant).
There are a number of new functions added that are useful,
so it is something that keeps me in maintainance.
When I read the all-new workspace/projects stuff, where I can
conveniently take my entire path and make it a workspace, I
made a load groan. Like Mark Hadfield mentioned, i think i
will ignore the new projects and workspaces and hope they go away.
And I do find it unbelievable that IDL did not have a DE under *nix
for all these years. Absolutely unbelievable. I very very much look
forward to the arrival of the eclipse environment.
Cheers,
bob
PS having ranted a bit there, I'd still say that IDL is a fantastic
tool for data analysis, and the ease of programming (and especially
debugging/ stepping through code and processing/graphing data that is
in mid-stream) is a major plus. It takes me seconds to bracket a problem
and figure it out in IDL. With my lousy fortran skills and the lack of a
good fortran DE - it takes me days to do the same thing in fortran.
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| Re: IDL 7.0 .... any new functions? [message #56998 is a reply to message #56986] |
Thu, 29 November 2007 08:45 |
Paul Van Delst[1]
Messages: 1157
Registered: April 2002
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Senior Member |
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David Fanning wrote:
> Haje Korth writes:
>
> At the moment, I find the Eclipse thing confusing and
> getting in the way of doing my work.
I had the same experience with the Eclipse plugin for Fortran95 (photran). I found eclipse
non-intuitive to use. And slow (but that was over a year ago now).
I guess I'm more of an old fart than I thought. I never experienced a serendipitous moment
with eclipse, just frustration since it wasn't giving me any new functionality
(FWIW, the whole "integrated with subversion/cvs" as one reason for using eclipse is lost
on me. Hasn't everyone been using version control software for the last decade or so already?)
> I expect this to
> improve as suggestions from younger users pour in here.
> Meanwhile the iPod my youngest son insisted I HAD to have,
> sits over there on the corner of my desk, unused. I can't
> even remember how to access the menu. Strange things
> happen when I move my fingers across it. Magic! :-(
I explicitly asked my wife *not* to buy me an iPod for birthday/chrissie/whatever. Just
what I need - something else that would encourage muggers on the Metro.
It's official: I'm a curmudgeonly old fart. :o)
>> I believe ITTVIS did the right thing
>> with this move. This step back to clean up an old mess was absolutely
>> necessary. I can definitely hear myself swearing less since eclipse came
>> into my life. :-)
>
> Cleaning up noise pollution is a worthy goal. And I applaud
> them for that. But certainly one of the jobs of a software
> company is to fix and improve software. I'd like to see some
> of that, too.
+1.
An official version of a *simple* plotting tool with rubber band box-zoom capability (ala
your ZPLOT, or my WPLOT) would still be a nice addition. It wouldn't be difficult to do
and sometimes a regular ol' hammer is the right tool for the job - not a pneumatic nailer
complete with its own air compressor.
BTW, are there any licensing issues I should be aware of if I commit the entire Coyote
library into our subversion system here? People check out my IDL scripts and a bunch of my
code falls in a heap coz the scripts use various and sundry Coyote IDL programs that are
in my local path, but not in other people's.
cheers,
paulv
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| Re: IDL 7.0 .... any new functions? [message #57006 is a reply to message #57005] |
Thu, 29 November 2007 06:13 |
David Fanning
Messages: 11724
Registered: August 2001
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Senior Member |
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David Fanning writes:
> Cleaning up noise pollution is a worthy goal. And I applaud
> them for that. But certainly one of the jobs of a software
> company is to fix and improve software. I'd like to see some
> of that, too.
In fairness, I will admit there have been improvements
in IDL since 6.1. At least there have been if you
make your definition of "improvement" broad enough to
encompass iTools. But, with one or two exceptions
(which, I am sorry, I can't think of at the moment), the
improvements have benefited someone other than me.
Oh!! I use the mouse-wheel capability on draw widgets!
I'm grateful for that, and I'll go cross it off my
list right now.
Cheers,
David
--
David Fanning, Ph.D.
Fanning Software Consulting, Inc.
Coyote's Guide to IDL Programming: http://www.dfanning.com/
Sepore ma de ni thui. ("Perhaps thou speakest truth.")
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| Re: IDL 7.0 .... any new functions? [message #57007 is a reply to message #57006] |
Thu, 29 November 2007 05:50 |
David Fanning
Messages: 11724
Registered: August 2001
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Senior Member |
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Haje Korth writes:
> I think you are being a little harsh here. Would you rather have spent the
> 500 bucks on yet another image processing tool, filter, etc. that you will
> never use?
Well, no. But I do have a (growing!) list of tools, filters,
etc. that I *would* use if someone where kind enough to
build them for me. I think I started this list back in the
days of IDL 6.1, if I remember correctly. I'm still waiting
to cross something off it.
> This DE thing was way over due, especially on Linux/Mac, where
> the old DE was completely unworkable.
No argument from me here. This will be a revelation to
legions of UNIX IDL programmes who find EMACS, uh, difficult.
I'm among them, and I can't even begin to tell you how
wonderful it is to have something like this on those machines.
I'm just saying, that unless ITTVIS is talking about
"growing" a cash crop (I find their web page confusing
on this issue), I'm not sure my next year of IDL
programming will look too much different from my last
year. I'm not a gadget sort of guy. A browser and a
newsreader are about all I need to keep me happy and
I'm pretty happy with what I use now.
At the moment, I find the Eclipse thing confusing and
getting in the way of doing my work. I expect this to
improve as suggestions from younger users pour in here.
Meanwhile the iPod my youngest son insisted I HAD to have,
sits over there on the corner of my desk, unused. I can't
even remember how to access the menu. Strange things
happen when I move my fingers across it. Magic! :-(
> I believe ITTVIS did the right thing
> with this move. This step back to clean up an old mess was absolutely
> necessary. I can definitely hear myself swearing less since eclipse came
> into my life. :-)
Cleaning up noise pollution is a worthy goal. And I applaud
them for that. But certainly one of the jobs of a software
company is to fix and improve software. I'd like to see some
of that, too.
Cheers,
David
--
David Fanning, Ph.D.
Fanning Software Consulting, Inc.
Coyote's Guide to IDL Programming: http://www.dfanning.com/
Sepore ma de ni thui. ("Perhaps thou speakest truth.")
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| Re: IDL 7.0 .... any new functions? [message #57008 is a reply to message #57007] |
Thu, 29 November 2007 05:05 |
Haje Korth
Messages: 651
Registered: May 1997
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Senior Member |
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David,
I think you are being a little harsh here. Would you rather have spent the
500 bucks on yet another image processing tool, filter, etc. that you will
never use? This DE thing was way over due, especially on Linux/Mac, where
the old DE was completely unworkable. I believe ITTVIS did the right thing
with this move. This step back to clean up an old mess was absolutely
necessary. I can definitely hear myself swearing less since eclipse came
into my life. :-)
Haje
"David Fanning" <news@dfanning.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.21b7ab0961d5e58198a105@news.frii.com...
> David Fanning writes:
>
>> Humm. I'm SURE there was a list...somewhere. :-(
>
> Ah, here it is. From the ITTVIS What's New in IDL
> web page:
>
> IDL - The Workbench
> IDL - The Power of Eclipse
> IDL - The Ability to Grow [Grow what!?]
> IDL - The Future is Bright
>
> Can't ask for much more than that for 500 clams a year!
>
> Cheers,
>
> David
>
> P.S. A guy could probably get a little discouraged about
> how his money is being spent, but...goodness...that future
> looks SO bright! Has anyone checked lately to see how
> MatLab's FutureRama Meter is looking?
>
> --
> David Fanning, Ph.D.
> Fanning Software Consulting, Inc.
> Coyote's Guide to IDL Programming: http://www.dfanning.com/
> Sepore ma de ni thui. ("Perhaps thou speakest truth.")
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| Re: IDL 7.0 .... any new functions? [message #57013 is a reply to message #57008] |
Wed, 28 November 2007 16:10 |
Michael Galloy
Messages: 1114
Registered: April 2006
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Senior Member |
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On Nov 28, 4:01 pm, Jean H <jghas...@DELTHIS.ucalgary.ANDTHIS.ca>
wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Moving to v7.0 is not the thing to do today (just finishing a project +
> any update = lot of problems that will make you weeks late). However I
> have read the little information that is available... but I haven't
> found anything about new functions, bug fixes etc... so is v7.0
> "simply" a new interface, or is there actually some new things under the
> hood???
>
> Jean
It's definitely sparse in non-Workbench stuff. (Of course, IDL 6.4
came out at the end of May this year.) Not sure about bug fixes, but
for new routines, from the "What's New":
The following new functions and procedures were added to IDL in this
release.
GET_LOGIN_INFO
Returns the name of the computer running the IDL process, as well as
the user's login name.
MAKE_RT
Creates a stand-alone IDL runtime distribution for one or more
platforms.
ROUTINE_FILEPATH
Returns the full path to a currently-compiled procedure or function
(or a list of procedures and functions).
Mike
--
www.michaelgalloy.com
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| Re: IDL 7.0 .... any new functions? [message #57075 is a reply to message #56986] |
Fri, 30 November 2007 01:30 |
proffmw@gmail.com
Messages: 3
Registered: November 2007
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Junior Member |
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On Nov 29, 9:39 am, Kenneth Bowman <k-bow...@tamu.edu> wrote:
> In article <MPG.21b7a6c03145300d98a...@news.frii.com>,
> David Fanning <n...@dfanning.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>> Note to Ken Bowman: I heard that 24-bit PostScript
>> support is VERY high on the *next* list.
>
> I swoon at the thought!
>
> Ken
So IDL 7.0 is out.
I have to admit that I don't look forward to new versions of IDL
anymore.
Version 2 made major strides; versions 3 did so too. Versions 4 and 5
added a few nice procedures/functions. I'm not sure that there's
anything
new in version 6 that I actually use.
But then again, I suppose I'm a bit of a dinosaur. I started using IDL
in 1981
(before versions???, but after SOL, when IDL ran on microVaxes). The
only
revolutionary things I've found at all useful are structures and
pointers.
I've never used object graphics. I've written one widget, and decided
it wasn't worth the effort. Widgets aren't any good
when you're constantly tinkering with the code - and my code (anything
longer
than about 10 lines) is never finished. I dislike IDLDE (I use Windows
only
under protest).
The IDL astronomy users library and the MPFIT routines are extremely
useful, but of course they come from users, and not ITT.
I'm a working scientist. I program what I need when I need it. I have
lots of
procedures that IDL got around to supplying after I'd written them
(it's a
pain when IDL decides to usurp one of my old routine names).
The machines I have scattered around the lab run versions 5.6 through
6.3.
Upgrading them means taking a major fraction of a day off to do it
(including
debugging all the paths). I upgrade when I get a new machine. So why
do I
keep maintenance? It's cheap (on an academic price plan), and lets me
upgrade
my workstations and laptops!
From a cold mountaintop, on a cold night,
Cheers,
Fred
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| Re: IDL 7.0 .... any new functions? [message #57131 is a reply to message #57075] |
Sat, 01 December 2007 10:39 |
MarioIncandenza
Messages: 231
Registered: February 2005
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Senior Member |
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Fred,
I sympathize with your ennui. The key here is that scientific
programmers, such as yourself and roughly 3/4 of this list, are not
enough of a revenue source to drive development of IDL. Development is
driven by application developers, who (I can only assume) pay more for
their licenses than we do :)
But as long as IDL doesn't *lose* functionality, I'll (tell my boss
to) keep paying the tab. And that's not an idly posed hypothetical,
either. Consider the case of ESRI. When ESRI decided application
developers were more important than researchers, they:
- obsoleted a working macro language;
- forced all scripting into an object-oriented framework with
100s of lines of overhead for simple tasks;
- walked away from Unix systems entirely (!)
Result: Many things I used to do in Arc, I now do-- in IDL. Which is
not always well-suited to the task.
Underneath the mountain, with pick and shovel,
--Edward H.
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